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[Eric Stepp]

Has anyone been keeping up with the Nepalese Kumari, 11-year-old Sajani Shakya? I started reading about Kumaris when Ms Shakya (not sure of Nepalese naming conventions) toured the US, was found to be "contaminated" by outside influences, and stripped of her title of "Living Goddess".

Now, it looks like her family has asked that she be no longer considered a Kumari, because her family "family wanted to perform their own religious rituals which required her to give up her divine position and rejoin her family."

Here's the article link:  Nepal's controversial 'living goddess' gives up position

I suppose my comment / question is more geared towards sociology, but I wanted to put something in the India and Central Asia category.   

Towards the end of the article is this quote:

Some human rights activists have petitioned the Supreme Court to end the practice saying it denies the girl her normal life.

My question is, who defines a "normal life"? Isn't that just a societal term, with no clear boundaries and is defined by norms and mores?

Who should decide what is a "normal life" for a Nepalese girl living in a country steeped in religious tradition? A bunch of Western activists whose normal lives consisted of living in a capitalist and commoditized society? Where the attention span is measured in seconds, rather than hours? Where money is more revered than one's own self? Where we (the majority) happily eschew our spiritual beliefs when they are inconvenient or get in the way of our economic progress?

Tell me, which person leads the "normal life."

[Emma Zahn]

Eric asked, "My question is, who defines a "normal life"?"

People who know best, of course.


Interesting subject.  According to the article, the position of Kumari has a natural term limit and it looks like Sajani may have reached it.  I wonder what her bride price will be.  Marrying a former goddess surely enhances a husband's status. 

[Eric Stepp]

Interesting subject.  According to the article, the position of Kumari has a natural term limit and it looks like Sajani may have reached it.  I wonder what her bride price will be.  Marrying a former goddess surely enhances a husband's status. 

Actually, it is considered extremely unlucky to marry a former Kumari, and the superstition is that the husband will die within 6 months. There are conflicting reports on just how common it is for former Kumari's to marry.

[nascardaughter]

Some human rights activists have petitioned the Supreme Court to end the practice saying it denies the girl her normal life.

My question is, who defines a "normal life"? Isn't that just a societal term, with no clear boundaries and is defined by norms and mores?

Who should decide what is a "normal life" for a Nepalese girl living in a country steeped in religious tradition? A bunch of Western activists whose normal lives consisted of living in a capitalist and commoditized society?

Yeah, it doesn't sound like an example of human rights violations to me either.  I was poking around online and found this interesting article. 

The royal kumari must have ‘a body shaped like a banyan tree, thighs like a deer’s, cheeks like a lion’s, a neck like a conch shell and a voice clear and soft as duck’s’. The royal priest’s wife confirmed that Preeti possessed these attributes and also had clear skin, black hair and eyes and a moist tongue.

There are some aspects of the practice as described in the article that sound problematic to me, although it also sounds like the community is pushing, successfully, for reform.

I have a hard time articulating where exactly the dividing line between cultural relativism and abuse/human rights violations is.  All I can really say is I know it when I see it.  Not the best argument, but...

[Hcberkowitz]

Yeah, it doesn't sound like an example of human rights violations to me either.  I was poking around online and found this interesting article. 

The royal kumari must have ‘a body shaped like a banyan tree, thighs like a deer’s, cheeks like a lion’s, a neck like a conch shell and a voice clear and soft as duck’s’. The royal priest’s wife confirmed that Preeti possessed these attributes and also had clear skin, black hair and eyes and a moist tongue.

There are some aspects of the practice as described in the article that sound problematic to me, although it also sounds like the community is pushing, successfully, for reform.

I have a hard time articulating where exactly the dividing line between cultural relativism and abuse/human rights violations is.  All I can really say is I know it when I see it.  Not the best argument, but...

Body shaped like a banyan tree? Lots of extra limbs?

Has anyone looked at a deer? Does a four-legged animal have two or four thighs?

Lion cheeks? Covered with yellow-brown fur?

Voice like a duck?  AFLAAAAC!

[Mike7]

Eric, some good questions. Apparently, religion is frequently wrapped up in desires for freedom, dignity and democracy where everyone is considered important simply for having been born. Nepal's monarchy, itself traditionally divine, is an odd traditional ally to the PRC while Tibetans, who had their own divine ruler, were crushed. Now we see protests by Tibetans in Lhasa, Tibet and also in Nepal, to which many fled. The reason those Nepalese cops are cracking them with truncheons I suspect, is out of deference to the atheist-gods of the "Peoples" Republic of China.

[nascardaughter]

Body shaped like a banyan tree? Lots of extra limbs?

Has anyone looked at a deer? Does a four-legged animal have two or four thighs?

Lion cheeks? Covered with yellow-brown fur?

Voice like a duck?  AFLAAAAC!

Aww, you ruined it!  I thought it was so beautiful.

The extra limbs, the descriptions of deer legs and lion cheeks, I could handle, but the AFLAC duck? 

There is just no poetry in that duck...

:-)

[Eric Stepp]

Body shaped like a banyan tree? Lots of extra limbs?

Has anyone looked at a deer? Does a four-legged animal have two or four thighs?

Lion cheeks? Covered with yellow-brown fur?

Voice like a duck?  AFLAAAAC!

Aww, you ruined it!  I thought it was so beautiful.

The extra limbs, the descriptions of deer legs and lion cheeks, I could handle, but the AFLAC duck? 

There is just no poetry in that duck...

:-)

I'm sure William Blake could find poetry there. 

[Devon]

I suppose my comment / question is more geared towards sociology, but I wanted to put something in the India and Central Asia category.   

Towards the end of the article is this quote:

Some human rights activists have petitioned the Supreme Court to end the practice saying it denies the girl her normal life.

My question is, who defines a "normal life"? Isn't that just a societal term, with no clear boundaries and is defined by norms and mores?

I'm assuming that these are human rights activists in Nepal, and not, as someone put it downthread, western activists?  If so, whether or not I come out agreeing with the activists, I think it's really important to have the debate.  Taking a child of 9 or whatever she would have been out of the life of a normal kid cannot be done with their full and informed consent; maybe it's a good thing, maybe it's a bad thing, maybe it depends on the kid, but I'd rather live in a society where the question is raised than one where kids just get sequestered like this without any potential recourse.